Why do all Professionals want to come to Canada?
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Posted on: 24-10-04 08:24:27
My friend Crenshaw ,
To my utter delight and to your disappointment u will always find me clarifying your own misleading arguments .
Sometimes u make it sound as if its easy enough for an average Indian CA to visit US to clear his CPA then come back and then apply for Canada .That sounds impractical like most of your other arguments .
Talking of substantiating I am still awaiting ur "own" found statistics .Somehow you arent coming out with it . I aint doubting the CD poll but pray read the whole forum from day 1 and u may have the exact poll in front of you .
And Yes I recall this IIM related statement of mine from the IMS study material .IMS ,Tardeo Rd Mumbai happen to be major Trainers for CAT Applicants ........ I had read this 5 years back and unfrtunately I didnt know I wud be meeting you on forum else I would have retained it with me .
But hey I was just asking for opinion ....Are the IIM / IIT guys any lower in calliber than Harvard / MIT guys ........ whats the harm in taking others opinion ?? ......BTW whats ur take on it ??
Thats Desimisri on Canadian Expereience thread
"Somewhere I read that the MBA in a good college in India is better than here. I studied at Davar’s in Mumbai and U of T here and anytime and anyplace anyone desires, I will write in my blood that Davar’s is much much better than U of T. Whoever compiled that list that says U of T is in the top 25 is gravely mistaken and biased. Everyone in our club who has studied in a college in India that is worth its salt and in universities here as well will vouch that the instruction and level of sophistication in India is better than here even taking McGill into consideration."
Manasvi
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
To my utter delight and to your disappointment u will always find me clarifying your own misleading arguments .
Would you care to show me which of my arguments were misleading, and how were they misleading?
A few posts above, you were the guy who said that Qatar had a far higher per capita income than Canada and quoted 2 weblinks that had numbers from 2002 for Qatar and 2000 for Canada. I rebutted that with numbers from the CIA factbook for 2003 that showed that Canada had a more than 20% higher GDP.
You were the guy who said that 80% of professionals in Canada, work at Tim Horton's, then you changed it to 70-80%, then you were not so sure.
On a separate thread, you were the guy who said that Chandresh got pink slipped because he told his employer that he was a CA, Chandresh clarified that the context in which your statements were made was not accurate and you came back to clarify your own arguments a little later........
.......Just 3 examples of how you made misleading arguments on this website.....I'm sure there are many more!
........and you say that I make misleading arguments...........LOL!!!
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
Sometimes u make it sound as if its easy enough for an average Indian CA to visit US to clear his CPA then come back and then apply for Canada .That sounds impractical like most of your other arguments .
Well, well, well, in the context in which I made those statements we were talking about 'above average' CA's from India weren't we? That's why I suggested that people who were making Rs 25k - Rs 50k per month in India, could well afford to travel to the states to write the exam, and should not have a problem with getting a visa either since they could demonstrate significant ties to India (secure job, et al).
BTW, one does not have to go to the States, appear for the CPA and 'then come back and apply' as you put it. The CPA could be written during the application process as well.........and the CPA would still enjoy reciprocity from the Ontario CA's as he wrote it before landing in Canada.
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
Talking of substantiating I am still awaiting ur "own" found statistics .Somehow you arent coming out with it . I aint doubting the CD poll but pray read the whole forum from day 1 and u may have the exact poll in front of you .
I never said that I was going to come up with "found" statistics. I don't believe that walking around streets in Toronto 'while clicking pictures' and talking to people in the washroom at a local mall is a reliable way of deriving statistics to quote 'authoritatively' as you have been doing.
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
And Yes I recall this IIM related statement of mine from the IMS study material .IMS ,Tardeo Rd Mumbai happen to be major Trainers for CAT Applicants ........ I had read this 5 years back and unfrtunately I didnt know I wud be meeting you on forum else I would have retained it with me .
Yeah sure, we trust your memory.
IMS guys who happen to be major trainers for CAT say that 95% of people who appear for GMAT would not be able to clear CAT!.....therefore I imagine that they say that the CAT is a very tough exam - therefore you need extra guidance and coaching and therefore you shoudl come to IMS. Ever heard of something called 'conflict of interest' of such organizations in doling out such numbers?
Unfortunately, we have a study conducted during 2004 (not 5 years ago) - the link to which has been provided by BKB above - that showed that the student quality was lowest out of 100 at IIM - A. It was also lowest among the ranked schools on the count of professional development and educational experience.
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
But hey I was just asking for opinion ....Are the IIM / IIT guys any lower in calliber than Harvard / MIT guys ........ whats the harm in taking others opinion ?? ......BTW whats ur take on it ??
Yup, you already have my take on it in the previous paragraph.
Quote:
Orginally posted by Manasvi
Thats Desimisri on Canadian Expereience thread
"Somewhere I read that the MBA in a good college in India is better than here. I studied at Davar’s in Mumbai and U of T here and anytime and anyplace anyone desires, I will write in my blood that Davar’s is much much better than U of T. Whoever compiled that list that says U of T is in the top 25 is gravely mistaken and biased. Everyone in our club who has studied in a college in India that is worth its salt and in universities here as well will vouch that the instruction and level of sophistication in India is better than here even taking McGill into consideration."
Yeah sure, now have you met Desimisri or do you have a great opinion of him just by reading his posts?...............
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Orginally posted by crenshaw
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Orginally posted by the-entrepreneur
S'up CDs,
Check this site out. It is the world famous London based "the Economist"'s site. Their intelligence unit rates IIM of Ahmedabad as no 64
in the world where MBA schools are concerned
http://mba.eiu.com/index.asp?layout=2002rankings
I just went over it with a cursory glance but could not find any Canadian institute above this.
BKB
Hey BKB
Schulich at York U is rated no. 22.......
Incidentally, if you read thru the details of the ranking, while IIM-A was number 1 on a couple of counts, it was number 100 out of 100 on the following:
- Personal development and educational experience
- Student quality
- Student diversity (was to be expected since all students are Indian)
- Increase in salary
- Final salary
In particular I found the fact that it ranked last on personal development and educational experience to be worrying!
Cheers
Cren
IIM is 100 out of 100 at least! What's disturbing is that Queen's U of T and McGill are not mentioned.
Yeah Crenshaw,
I saw that later on, that Schulich is at 22. But thanks anyway. I was wondering what happened to Queen’s, U of T and McGill, but I found their rankings on other sites like Forbes.com (Queen’s is no 10) and others. All different criteria are used in each survey. But nonetheless, it is disturbing to learn that Queen’s and others did not make The Economist’s list, though after visiting their campuses and classes and talking to the professors, I feel they should have made the grade, even under the criteria used. Anyway, that again is my opinion.I ain’t about to write a missive to The Eco saying they are wrong.
BTW , this forum is for people to voice their opinion and their experiences as they see fit, not to be substantiated with sites and other references of studies, which can also be biased; nothing is free of human emotion. If people in the Middle East think there are better off there so be it. If there are those in Canada who think they are better off, so be it. Big deal. It ain’t gonna stop the droves of people who wanna come here, as in general Canada is considered a better country to live in than where they come from and also the 12th least corrupt in the world. India, Egypt, East Europe, Congo, Ethiopia are at the bottom of the ladder.Everything in general points to Canada being better than all countries from where immigrants come in huge numbers. Nothing anybody says on this forum is gonna change that. It is only in specific cases where this may not be true. In my case I am slumming it out compared to India, but I can see myself way ahead in a coupla years because of the way I am. For me a guy earning Rs 20,000- Rs50,000 is wasting his time in India. He should be here, provided his English is good, is confident(not diffident) and has an undying spirit. I earned over 1 lac per month there and I came here, and had I read this site before coming here, maybe I would have been influenced otherwise (though I doubt it, I was lured by the prospects of seeing Clapton, Santana, et al live
). Anyway, if you are wondering what this tirade is all about, it is to tell you that I agree with you on most everything you say, though I do not agree with the aggressive tone you sometimes use.
Anyway, I hope you don’t mind me posting some sites on this forum and if you have time answer the question I pose. I am conducting a scientific study to present to certain govt bodies and it has to be corroborated with references. By the way, even though the percentages stated on this forum are out of whack, the body we have hired to conduct a study to see how many immigrant professionals are here employed in anything but their original professions after 3 years here has come up with more than 50%. However some are in related professions, so that’s good, but some are still languishing in shovelling feces, using a figurative term of speech. But you know something, a high percentage of those polled, these are people who claim they came here on point systems, the body did not actually see if they had the degrees to back it up, were extremely satisfied that they moved to Can from wherever. The study was not only done on desis, as the case is to be made to the govt for all immigrants in general. Let me tell you though that the number of professional people doing odd jobs after 3 years is below 50%, much below it. However it is significant enough to warrant looking into to rectify it, so we believe. Now we have to convince the govt. of that. Some very influential Chinese and Russians are going to make the case. Unfortunately, we approached many influential desis and none were interested in backing us up. Maybe if we keep hammering, perhaps. But we have a time constraint.
It might be interesting to note that a certain Phd by the name of Dr Sharma, whose story was run by The Voice a year ago, came here and was working in Food basics. A year later, she is now working as a teacher of Microbiology at CDI. The body actually called the Voice asked for her telephone number and called her to see if she was still working at Food basics or had progressed. To the body’s delight they found she had a great job now.
Anyway, just to show what an undying spirit can do.Her English, though good, is not all that fantastic. Mine is better than hers and I don’t consider mine to be all that hot shot.
BKB
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Sorry, found Queen's at no. 69.
Also U of B.C at 70
Univ of west. Ont. at 75,
But McGill and U of T didn't make it. Very surprising!
BKB
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Get what you want by helping others get what they want
Here's a link that people may find interesting, on how US and Canada schools are in India recruiting, including York at 22
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/897005.cms
BKB
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Get what you want by helping others get what they want
Quote:
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Orginally posted by Manasvi
Thats Desimisri on Canadian Expereience thread
"Somewhere I read that the MBA in a good college in India is better than here. I studied at Davar’s in Mumbai and U of T here and anytime and anyplace anyone desires, I will write in my blood that Davar’s is much much better than U of T. Whoever compiled that list that says U of T is in the top 25 is gravely mistaken and biased. Everyone in our club who has studied in a college in India that is worth its salt and in universities here as well will vouch that the instruction and level of sophistication in India is better than here even taking McGill into consideration."
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Yeah sure, now have you met Desimisri or do you have a great opinion of him just by reading his posts?...............
Above by Crenshaw
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Dear Crenshaw,
As BKB has pointed out, this forum is to express one's opinion and I am just expressing mine. If Gallup or any other person conducting a poll came to me and asked me if the level of instruction at Davar's was better in my day than U of T, I would answer in the affirmative. I believe the level of instruction is reflective of the quality of the faculty.If you go to BKB's site and see under faculty quality, IIM (overall ranking 54) is 50, and York (overall ranking 22) is 69. The only one in Canada that beats IIM is Queen's at 40, but its overall ranking is 69 below IIM and York. So level of instruction has nothing to do with overall performance. As the same site suggests, IIM in personality dev is 100. I would agree that using the western personality as basis, the Indian personality is weak. Few Indians have a strong handshake, which is a big thing here.
However, being an U of T alumnus, I am pretty upset that it is not mentioned in this survey. Since I still have strong ties with U of T, I will ask the office if anybody from The Economist did visit them or not. Then I will definitely shoot off a letter to the Economist accordingly. Imagine Rotman not in the survey. This is heresy.
Desimisri
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while in Rome do as the Romans do
Dear CDs,
It is interesting to note on the site provided by BKB that Japan has only one MBA school worth talking about and that too its overall rating is 84,below all of Canada's schools and below IIM- yet it has the 2nd largest economy in the world. I don't know but it just caught my eye and it is rated 100 in many categories.
Whenever a Japanese economist, banker, or person from the financial field comes into town, we are encouraged to go and attend their seminars to learn something because they are a powerhouse, but it would seem their schools are useless. As a matter of fact we are literally pushed to their seminars. Not so if financial experts from other parts of the world (excepting US and perhaps Hong Kong) come here.
BKB, I do not know what this means, but I will tell you my office's reactions within 2-3 days.
Desimisri
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while in Rome do as the Romans do
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