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Originally posted by Nightmare

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Originally posted by meghal

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Originally posted by febpreet

A very good write-up on how Indian middle class fair in present times. With stagnant growth, over the roof inflation, and low number of jobs available for B.Techs/BEs/MBAs, and other Graduates, they are feeling the heat now, coupled with a little return on their investments.


Thanks.

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A proliferation of mediocre to low quality engineering/business schools, who treat education as business rather than focussing on academics can also be blamed in increase in unemployment. And given almost no social security net, I shudder what would happen should India face same recession as US. However, given the "internal demand", I think it won't be as bad as US.

Having been exposed to both Indian and Canadian university, I now realise the stark difference between the quality of education and the infrastructure (or absence of it) between Canadian and Indian universities. A cursory look at the question papers available on Gujarat university's website indicates how easy it is to pass even a master's level exam.

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A cursory look at Institute of Chartered Accountants of Canada makes me also shudder. The pass rate is 92%. It means virtually whoever joins program, passes. I agree that "average" university graduate of Canada is certainly more well oriented than India but all is not rosy here. I would ask other CDs to contribute their experience of university graduates. I supervised Canadian graduates as well as Indian graduates. I had two graduates from H.L. College of Ahmedabad working under me and they were much better than Canadian graduates. \i have very steadfastly held a belief that in any country, 10% of the populace is intelligent and the rest does not matter because that 10% elite would be running the businesses. Political administration is another issue. Sheer size of population in India and China give these countries great advantage. It is because of the political administration that India is lagging far behind the Western countries and it is the same political dictatorship in China that gives it an edge over the rest of the world. Further, how "easy" the paper is cannot be and should not be a criteria. It is ultimate number of students which are declared successful that should matter. I have two colleagues who teach in UT and they say that they have to ensure that "Success rate" is around 80%. It should be well known to experienced CDs that Universities here use "Bell Curve" to ensure such a success rate. I would not berate GU. These days quite a few CA program toppers in India are from GU. Equally important is work culture and willingness to work hard. I would agree that average student here is much more equipped than average student in India.

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When i started my job in Canada my manager told me that he had the chance to interview at least 20 computer graduates from a Canadian university who could not even tell "How many bits are in one byte".

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When i started my job in Canada my manager told me that he had the chance to interview at least 20 computer graduates from a Canadian university who could not even tell "How many bits are in one byte".

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Too bad! Your manager based his generalization on JUST 20 computer graduates from Canadian Universities.

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Originally posted by web2000

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Originally posted by Nightmare

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Originally posted by meghal

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Originally posted by febpreet

A very good write-up on how Indian middle class fair in present times. With stagnant growth, over the roof inflation, and low number of jobs available for B.Techs/BEs/MBAs, and other Graduates, they are feeling the heat now, coupled with a little return on their investments.


Thanks.

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A proliferation of mediocre to low quality engineering/business schools, who treat education as business rather than focussing on academics can also be blamed in increase in unemployment. And given almost no social security net, I shudder what would happen should India face same recession as US. However, given the "internal demand", I think it won't be as bad as US.

Having been exposed to both Indian and Canadian university, I now realise the stark difference between the quality of education and the infrastructure (or absence of it) between Canadian and Indian universities. A cursory look at the question papers available on Gujarat university's website indicates how easy it is to pass even a master's level exam.

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A cursory look at Institute of Chartered Accountants of Canada makes me also shudder. The pass rate is 92%. It means virtually whoever joins program, passes. I agree that "average" university graduate of Canada is certainly more well oriented than India but all is not rosy here. I would ask other CDs to contribute their experience of university graduates. I supervised Canadian graduates as well as Indian graduates. I had two graduates from H.L. College of Ahmedabad working under me and they were much better than Canadian graduates. \i have very steadfastly held a belief that in any country, 10% of the populace is intelligent and the rest does not matter because that 10% elite would be running the businesses. Political administration is another issue. Sheer size of population in India and China give these countries great advantage. It is because of the political administration that India is lagging far behind the Western countries and it is the same political dictatorship in China that gives it an edge over the rest of the world. Further, how "easy" the paper is cannot be and should not be a criteria. It is ultimate number of students which are declared successful that should matter. I have two colleagues who teach in UT and they say that they have to ensure that "Success rate" is around 80%. It should be well known to experienced CDs that Universities here use "Bell Curve" to ensure such a success rate. I would not berate GU. These days quite a few CA program toppers in India are from GU. Equally important is work culture and willingness to work hard. I would agree that average student here is much more equipped than average student in India.

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When i started my job in Canada my manager told me that he had the chance to interview at least 20 computer graduates from a Canadian university who could not even tell "How many bits are in one byte".

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Hmm Canadian with "emotional intelligence" have little financial literacy.

"On February 9, 2011, the Task Force on Financial Literacy delivered its proposed strategy to Finance Minister Jim Flaherty for improving Canadians’ financial IQ. Michael Callahan outlines several key recommendations that tie into the role that professional financial advice plays in helping clients make sound financial decisions

Financial decisions made early in life play a significant role in determining future financial success. Yet, there are few resources available to teach young adults introductory personal financial skills.

The Canadian education system teaches little to nothing when it comes to practical, personal financial management. “Go to school and get a job!” seems to be the prevailing wisdom. Okay, but then what? While our schools may teach us how to earn money, they don’t really teach us anything about how to manage it.

We’re constantly faced with real-life decisions requiring at least some degree of financial know-how. Sadly, the majority of Canadians lack the skills necessary to make informed decisions when it comes to their finances."

http://www.advocis.ca/forum/FMarchives11/FM-mar11/mar11-financial-literacy.html

As I said before, both technical and soft skills are required. People with just soft skills end up like Obama - No sense of financial responsibility. Obama spent trillions with zero job growth rate. Common sense says that a custom duty of 25% on Chinese goods would solve revenue and jobs problem. Even a softer common sense solution of Tea Party is ignored by people with emotional intelligence.

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Originally posted by meghal

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Originally posted by san-hugo

So friends ,

If asked about one major reason you would like to go back to India , where will you put your finger ?

g. I miss my maid in India

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A valid reason for Shiney Ahuja

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Huh nice one ! There are many such Shiney Immigrant Ahujas here, who put 'easy affordable maid services' as a point for advantage India during the Canada-India comparison game.

Ideally, more you grow aged in Canada, more you should miss your maid in India !!
Why Shiney missed his maid while he is still young is some kind of mystressry , correction.. mystery to me !!

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Originally posted by meghal

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Originally posted by Nightmare
I had two graduates from H.L. College of Ahmedabad working under me and they were much better than Canadian graduates. \i have very steadfastly held a belief that in any country, 10% of the populace is intelligent and the rest does not matter because that 10% elite would be running the businesses.

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Similarly, in some other place, two graduates from Canadian universities will be better than 10 other graduates from Indian universities.

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I would agree that average student here is much more equipped than average student in India.

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I believe that the main purpose of university education is to encourage independent thinking and develop communication skills - avenues where most of the Indian universities fail miserably. The only thing that Indian universities has encouraged is personal coaching classes - so that even an average graduate is even spared of the entire thinking process. University degree is a tool for men to get a job and for a girl to increase her "marketability" in marriage market. I believe India would be better off by adopting Western university system - having polytechnics to teach the basic employment skills and universities for higher education that requires thinking skills.

In Canadian universities, exam dates are not extended by student demands, student do not go on strike and harass professors or damage university property.

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This is a news item from U.K. This should be interesting for you since you believe that India should adopt "Western Standards" in education.

[GCSE results out today will signal the end to decades of relentless ‘grade inflation’ as rigour is returned to the education system, experts believe………… The ‘significant slowdown’ – after 23 years of rampant increases – marks the end of Labours ‘we shall all have prizes’ culture, and has been attributed to measures designed to end the dumbing-down of exams.]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2029849/GCSE-results-mark-end-Labours-grade-inflation.html

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Originally posted by Nightmare

This is a news item from U.K. This should be interesting for you since you believe that India should adopt "Western Standards" in education.

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Like the way you drag totally irrelevant info into the discussion when you run out of ammo.

First you somehow bring Obama, then the financial literacy of Canadians, now the UK schools.

I am talking only about North American universities.

What is the point of teaching economics/finance/marketing to a person who is going to become a policeman or work in a call centre or a lady who is going to become a receptionist or a bookkeepr? They just stake up more space in university and become a financial burden to taxpayers in cases where university education for girls is free and ultimately get classified as "shikshit bekaar"

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Originally posted by meghal

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Originally posted by Nightmare

This is a news item from U.K. This should be interesting for you since you believe that India should adopt "Western Standards" in education.

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Like the way you drag totally irrelevant info into the discussion when you run out of ammo.

First you somehow bring Obama, then the financial literacy of Canadians, now the UK schools.

I am talking only about North American universities.

What is the point of teaching economics/finance/marketing to a person who is going to become a policeman or work in a call centre or a lady who is going to become a receptionist or a bookkeepr? They just stake up more space in university and become a financial burden to taxpayers in cases where university education for girls is free and ultimately get classified as "shikshit bekaar"

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Ha! Ha! Ha! With you, no question of running out of ammo....
I dragged your God Obama because he is the ideal example of "soft Skills" guy you are so fond of. Supposedly he has degree from Harvard but it is like SC/St guys in India who are OFFERED rather than EARN the qualification. Now that perfect "Soft Skill" guy has dragged entire USA and world in to financial quagmire and that is the reason I stated that one has to have both soft skills and solid knowledge of the subject.

Now when I quoted U.K. University, which is no different from Canadian, you start talking about North American! I did quote a piece about financial illiteracy of Canadians but then you suffer from selective amnesia!

While you talk about "shikshit bekaar", you seem to forget that North american unemployment is much higher than India's rate!

Just look at the statistics of student loan default rate of soft skilled guys. Soft skill is highly subjective crap. You must be one of those guys who is highly impressed by whites speaking English with North American accent and presuming that as a soft skill. I do not think Indians lag much in soft skills. It is just that English is their second language and hence they lack expression power. at the same time, Chinese who absolutely are rude and manner less get the jobs because they are perceived by North American to be INTELLIGENT and HARDWORKING - hardly the soft skills that you are looking for.

I did gave example of Steve Jobs who was driven out of Apple and brought back to revive almost bankrupt Apple because of his superior intellect, work ethics and technical knowledge. He made Apple the biggest corporation in the world in a few years and Obama would make the biggest nation bankrupt in next four years. That is the difference, my friend, between soft skills and solid knowledge.

It is not to say that soft skills are useless. There is a proverb" Be roman in Rome". If one wants a job in North America , one needs soft skills because North America is swarming with soft skill people. But wait, where is a job in North America? Guess all this B**l S**t about soft skills would be gone when China takes over and makes North America sweat for them but it may take a few years. Till then, bask in glory while it lasts. Then you have option to join swelling ranks of Obama loving morons living off EI benefits paid by hard working people.