I am not giving a boom to anyone anytime soon

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I once made a mistake, but I was wrong about it.

Hi All:

During the course of my stay here in Canada and European countries(Hungary,Poland) andEast Asia(Singapore,Malaysia and Philippines) ,I have been lucky enough to make several friends from all ethnic nationalities and races.Using my insights from such interactions,and of course drawing upon my own experiences and qualifications(as an accountant and an MBA),I would like to share the following:

Canada and USA have historically been serviced by immigrants.Historically,in the 1920s and 1930s, such immigrants were selectively allowed from European countries (whites) and blacks (mostly people who escaped slavery from USA and imports from Africa);Yellow people(Chinese immigrants) who were used to build the highways and railroads in BC.Canada had a predefined goal in its immigration policies in that each wave of immigrants was expected to contribute.For instance:

(a)Many people may not be aware that the initial wave of white immigrants to Canada were very harshly treated at the port of disembarkation at Halifax(which usually was the port of entry).They had to be physically fit,not have any disease or ailment,be prepared to take ANY job or take jobs allotted (sometimes) by the immigration officer on the spot.Many intending sick immigrants were often refused entry at the ships itself and forced to go back to their own countries whence they had departed. Now the initial policy was that the white European immigrants developed the land from the native Indians of North America(the Metis, the Innui and the Aborigines) and drew upon the physical labour of the Chinese and Black immigrants to build the infrastructure around us.As a matter of fact, before slavery was abolished, it was a WRITTEN RULE oF LAW that non white immigrants were not allowed into Canada and USA. This law was overturned only in the later half of the 19th century when Abraham Lincoln abolished slavery and Jackson made his famous Human Rights speech (To my children Yolanda, Martin King Jr.... etc etc....in the hope that they live in a world where they are not judged by the colour of their skin)........It was then that the immigration wave of people of colour began.

(b) Before the European settlers allowed mass immigration, they took pains to ensure that they controlled all important positions in government and industry,mainly depending on their background and whence they came from.For instance, the Jews of Germany and Austria,Hungary and Poland who were reputed good financiers and bankers set up their own private banks and financial companies.(Bank of Montreal was originally,I think Jewish founders)etc...the immigrants of Ireland,Scotland and Wales were good at farming and agriculture and set up farms and similiar establishments, the immigrants from Europe(France,Italy,Spain,Netherlands) were people of cultural background(singers,musicians,painters and they settled in and around what is known as Toronto today) and developed the cultural base of Toronto.

(c) Towards the early 20th century, Europe was in a flux.Hitler was doing his wars, the european nations were all fighting with each other, famines were all over the UK and Ireland(the Great Potato famine)....so wave after wave of immigrants came and flooded Canadian shores.It may be interesting to note that at that time the only port of entry was Halifax Harbour in Nova Scotia(this explains why most British, Scottish and Irish settlers and origins live in and around Nova Scotia).Gradually these people slowly moved west towards Toronto and gradually further west to British Columbia.

(d) So far thus,immigration was strictly controlled and immigrants of colour allowed only to the extent workers were needed.It is also interesting to note that visitor arrivals into North America,was , fora brief period not permitted to coloured immigrants.

(e) During the 1940s and 1950s immigration policies stopped taking people in.These years were consolidation years wherein the immigrants admitted earlier were allowed to settle in,raise families,and populate the land with their new born.Since there was no stress of any wars,famines etc, the people were able to raise larger number of children in huge numbers.This spawned the "baby boomer generation".;

(f) This trend continued throughout the 1960s to the 1970s.

(g) As the 21st century came upoin us, so also the Information Age came .The Use of the internet spread knowledge of distant lands everywhere and the white people settled here could no longer prevent coloured immigrants from coming in without appearing"discriminatory".The people born in the 1940s and 1950s were also slowly retiring and fading off from the work places.People born during the 1960s were relatively more pampered and educated higher levels compared to their parent generationb.;As a result, the workers of the 1960s was able to industrialize and modernize much of North America.Such people were generally again white immigrants.

(h) During this half of the century, the people born in 1960s started retiring.Here as may be observed,people retire when they are still active enough to pursue a hobby.Hence people born in 1960 would be around 45-50 by now;close enough for "retirement".So gaps were predicted in the work place.It is these gaps that is sought to be filled in by the present day immigration policies.

(i) I would not be surprised to hear comments that the reality is different.and that in Toronto it is difficult to get jobs.But,I would point out that in reality many many jobs are available outside of Toronto.I ahve been fortunate to get jobs in Barrie, Collingwood, and now in Peterborough where I currently reside.In all these places,i have never been asked for Canadian work experience,or lack of qualifications.The focus was more on ability to speak english and ability to do the job in question.Toronto is overcrowded with immigrants and thus we have the situation of too many immigrants for few job vacancies/.

(j) The other reality is that Canada wants immigrants;not workers.There is a difference. Workers come in the expectation of making money.Like our Malayalees in the Gulf who come for making money and then go back. An immigrant on the other hand is someone who has come to settle in for good,with all his cultural,emotional and family background to this country,and make his fortune with his hands ,brains and wits around him.Now again, it is known based on human nature that 99% of immigrants flock together and come to the same place.It is often the rare 1% of people who strike a new path and make their fortune.By admitting waves of waves of immigrants,sometime, the 1% accumulates and gradually becomes sizeable in number thereby bringing about development of canadian economy as a whole.In other words, it is the rare immigrant who is ready to risk all and strikes it rich in new,unexplored places and areas.Such areas need not be necessarily job oriented or glamourous manager posts.Now the Government cannot ensure that every immigrant go to Manitoba or NW Territories;but at most it can try to bring people here and leave it to them to go forth and settle elsewhere.But at some point, eventually the law of numbers will take over;for eg when immigrants cant find jobs in Toronto,they will slowly either start businesses or move out of Toronto(which is precisely what the Government wants).

The other aspect is that white people here mostly do not know enough about our country and often have stereotyped notions of how we live,behave and are educated based on their interactions with other fellow Indians or people of colour.So often for lack of knowledge or ignorance they turn away potential candidates for jobs.This is not the fault of Canadian Government;rather a mutual task of educating and sensitising local whites about our abilities and character.In general,I have found that white people who have travelled widely are not so insular as the locals and are more broad minded in outlook and approach with non whites.

The financial aspects have already been covered by others/.Only point to make is that the money pumped into the economy feeds unemployed landed immigrants(on EI) and helps develop facilities for housing and education for immigrants.


Hope that helps bring some perspective to the discussion;I willwrite more when I get more thoughts flowing.....
Sathish

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Sathish Subramanian
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I don't think Canada's objective in inviting immigrants is ONLY to share its wealth and prosperity. They stand to gain as much from immigrants as they promise to offer, hence the drive to get more people in. No country is going to have a liberal immigration policy if they know that its going to end up hurting the economy and mess up the infrastructure of the country. If you guys remember, a recent census revealed the gravity of the role immigrants play in keeping the economy churning. For e.g., would the real-estate market be even half as hot if not for immigrants? And consider what a tremendous impact this one sector has on other industries, which inevitably leads to job-creation and growth.

Without immigrants, I believe the economy would slow down significantly. And the Canadian govt. knows this.

Besides, imagine how much money the govt. has to spend and how long they have to wait in creating say a Canadian engineer with 5 years of experience. With immigration, they get the package instantly without spending anything at all, rather they get paid to let this person in.

Conversely, there are hundreds of thousands of qualified people around the planet who're not happy in the countries they live in. The lure of a better life and a brighter future leaves them wanting and thus they apply for immigration here.

To me, its a win-win situation for both. I don't see any victimisation here at all, its a mutually beneficial scenario. Nobody is being Santa Claus here.

(To Canada's credit, they do also have one of the most liberal refugee policies, and in this case, I think they stand to lose more than they gain, at least initially)

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Quote:

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Orginally posted by BlueLobster

Conversely, there are hundreds of thousands of qualified people around the planet who're not happy in the countries they live in. The lure of a better life and a brighter future leaves them wanting and thus they apply for immigration here.

(To Canada's credit, they do also have one of the most liberal refugee policies, and in this case, I think they stand to lose more than they gain, at least initially)

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"Change before you have to" : Jack Welch

Bio,

I do agree that more can be done to help immigrants blend in smoothly. Right now, the govt. provides a few initial services, but for the most part they're left to fend for themselves. But there's only so much that the govt. can do too, they can't force companies to hire newly-landed immigrants.

I think one of the initiatives in this direction is the targeted immigration policy that they're devising, i.e. pre-decide the province the immigrant will go to. I believe in this case, they're either going to promise jobs or at least put more effort in helping immigrants find jobs in their own fields.

And as far as the "GET PASSPORT - TAKE NEXT FLIGHT OUT" attitude goes, what do you think is the percentage of the people who do that? I don't believe its that much, I would venture to say its less than 5% of the immigrants who decide to stay back. But that's just an educated guess based on how many naturalised citizens I meet here.

I agree, during the first or second year of struggle, this is the idea. Just get a Canadian passport and scram. However after about 4/5 years, most people don't leave.

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That’s what I exactly want to say if anybody offers a dinner with some promise to pay 10,000 on their behalf & we accept it without knowing the facts. Are we people fools??? Something is there that attracts to us also!! Agar ek banda aapna matlab nikaal raha hai toh dusara banda itna bhi sidha nahi hai ki us bande ka matlab nikal janney de. Without his/her purpose they can’t come in any one’s deception!! Chandresh you say that outsider come here to help them without any benefit, they ofcourse have some benefit like money, quality of life etc etc. it’s a mutually beneficial scenario.

Even UAE wants immigrants becoz their economy also functions smoothly becoz of us. But are they doing something for the benefit of immigrants? Nope not at all!!! Even they are imposing lots of stupid rules to them. Where as Canada is doing something for immigrants. They give us permanent status not like UAE (where we always feel insecure). So chandresh this is a mutual beneficial scenario!!!!!!!!! As mentioned by BL.

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I read this article with interest. Having been in the UAE for 13 years, I would like to place my opinion . As Jyoti put it, there are quite a few rules which are more stupid (stupid is a wrong word). Sons over 18 cannot live with their parents.Education costs right from school level is costly. Unless one knows how to butter his boss, he cant dream of going up the ladder. More than anything else, one cannot become a citizen here. Yes, this place is quite secure as regs crimes, mugging etc but then can one sleep in the night with the uncertainity whether he would have his job the next morning? People get the order of the boot for unknown, unexplained reasons. An employer can change the basic salary on which the terminal benefits cling to (I mean a reduction!!!).There are rules on paper that the employer bears the health and visa renewal fee of the employees but most of them dont! And a rule one day can become illegal the next! Dubai is quite sensible in its offices but Abu Dhabi and other emirates can be awful

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Good luck to everyone