Hi,

This is in just to respond lots of negative posts about Canada..

I've seen a lot of (Not IT, Accountants not from Middle east) people doing very well including Pharmacist, Elec. Engg, AutoMobile Engg, Financial Analysts, Business Analyst, $$Tradspersons$$. Well also business people who were forced to do business in lack of opportunity to work.
Either these successful ( by successful I do not meaning driving a BMW car while owning a huge mansion in Canada) adapted or upgraded their
skills to meet the expectation of the local market or lucky..

Did Canadian Immigration knock ones door to immigrate to Canada, Did we apply to CIC or CIC applied for us and asked to sign?
Didn't we use internet some 5 years back.. Didn't we have any Indians living in Canada 5 years back.
Didn't we know Canada is cold.
Didn't we know Canada has a Govt sponsored Medical facility, in some provinces one gets coverage sooner than Ontario, Whether its good or bad, it is certainly
better than $1000/monthly US insurance where you will end up paying 20% if you've lost the Job and also need to pay from your pocket apart from Housing..


One can go on discussing about the negatives about any country not just Canada. I can write a whole page about US, coz I lived there for 8 years.. Esp.., the wonderful welcome message given at the borders and airports, Child crime, looting,mugging, outsourcing, school shooting, $$ pressure from Private schools, always stressed work style, I understand its not just Milk and honey country, one can face his own problems specific to US such as a wonderful welcome message from Immigration officer ( 2 hrs interview even one comes back from Vacation), Seperate security check in all european airport for passengers heading to US (So, other countries are piece of Crap...Huh..), Rape, Child abductions, Frequent Child molestation cases, Flying healthcare prices (its real pleasant to pay 1000$ for insurance when one loses his Job) unlike poor Canada which covers me despite my Job status, Scary Social Security which may be a history when I retire, Outsourcing, Ultra pressured work environment, oh BTW a Million or more people are going to line up for GC, more and more.....

Well they are just few -ves about USA, I can write more than a page of +s about USA, I beleive same with Canada and India......

etc.., etc.,(My point is not to be cynical about US but just want to highlight some problems).

Apart from upgrading/adapting skills, I believe language does matter. I wouldn't call picking the local language any kind of rocket science..
I've seen Indian Sales person speaking fluent Arabic just after a year of their life in Middle East, The same should work for the language here too when one is pushed
to the extent to learn this else a challenge to survive.

Too much of anything is too bad... Same applies to publishing more than year long negative portrayals too..

Finally, I agree that there are hurdles exist in Canada, I think they exist everywhere in the world.. US, India, Middle East is no exception.....
but I still find it is a better idea to explore how others managed....

- JRF

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The cowards never started,
The weak died on the way,
Only the strong arrived.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yK1i9cLAMM

I fully agree with JRF. Every country has its own positive and negative points. Before immigrating to any country, one should weigh the positives and negatives and then take a decision. CIC never painted a rosy picture for immigrants.... it is the so called immigration consultants or agents who do that, mainly to make a quick buck.

Once you have come to a country, try to adapt to it, upgrade your skills and if nothing works out it is best to move on.... either to another country, which u think is better or India. Whats the point of whining or cribbing.... thats not going to solve any problem.

People after moving here suddenly seem to have discovered that India is indeed shinning..... No doubt India is making rapid strides in certain areas specially IT, salaries levels are increasing but look at the other side.... has poverty reduced significantly? What about the gap between rich and poor? Or the corruption?The pollution? How long will it take for India to overcome these to be truly called a developed country?

What I am trying to say is one can write a lot, both positives and negatives about any country. It is up to each one to decide where he wants to live, depending on his own unique situation...but once you have come to a decision, try and make it work. No point harping on all the negatives...

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JM

My theory is simple. One would not consider moving from a country IF everything was rosy. The problem here is that peole loose focus on the motivator.

Canada is a nation of immigrants. Every Indian, every Chinese, even every gora immigrated here(or their parents did). Are they all starving? Are they all frustrated? All of Canada is not working in the IT field. In fact, if you are an IT person, I would say, go to India. That is where all of the world's IT dept is going to be soon.

I truly beleive that some folks have this attitude of entitlement. They forget, that the immigration visa is a priviledge and not their birth right. Having expectations is not a problem. Being frustrated and blaming everyone because they don't materialize is ridiculous. I think they should take the blame now, just as they will take the credit when their kids thank them in the future.

BV

BIG VEE you are right on the money in terms of IT!. I know several IT guys in companies like HP in Canada, who had solid permanent jobs for more than 5 years, who were laid off recently have gone to Bangalore, India for undergoing SAP training.

The following areas are in the process of moving to India:

1.IT Departments.

2.Law & IPR-Intellectual Property Departments.

3.Finance & Accounting Departments-there is a wave already happening in US currently, where in they are downsizing these departments and outsourcing it to Indian companies. A friend of mine is currently in USofA with GM and in the process of setting up a outsourcing contract for the accounting-finance department. He is from a big corporate house in India, they will take the contract and then distribute it to smaller companies in India. This will lead to axing thousands of jobs in GM. He tells me that the CPA's are already giving him the cold stare(s).I also know that HP Canada has recently axed several jobs in their accounts department and I do not whatever happened to those jobs?.

4.Call Centers-Customer Service.

5.Automobile Manufacturing and Ancillaries- Just watch what is going to happen after the Delphi-GM issue due in June 2006.

6.Anything related to medical transcription, interpretation of test results involving radiography, CAT, MR Scans.

7.Anything involving Chemical, Pharmaceutical, Material Science and related physical sciences research. If we look at the American Chemical Society's premier magazine-Chemical & Engineering News in the last 3 issues, all the issues are focussing on India's emergence in the fundamental research. They are againg talking about how the outsourcing boom as hit these sectors and companies are moving their corporate R&D setups to Bangalore, Pune and Mumbai. The issue dated March 20, 2006 is titled \\\"INDIA-Scientific powerhouse in the making\\\". They are talking about the rapid way Indian companies, the Government is funding research in India.This issue also talks about availability of equipments in Indian set up which are not available even in top laboratories in US of A.The website is http://www.cen-online.org.Here" rel="nofollow">LINK again they are talking about shortage of trained scientist. The salaries offered are mind boggling starting at Rs.10 to 15 Lakhs for a Indian PhD to anywhere from Rs.25 to 35 Lakhs for an US PhD.The sky is the limit for experienced people in this field. If somebody looks at Jack Welch research centres jobs listing it is so exhaustive to find so many top notch jobs being advertised for there.

Side Note: The counter attack of Desis taking away jobs in the field of Physical Sciences has started the Goras counter attacking in a similar way to the call center or IT jobs. There are many Goras who are willing to move to India to work in a good laboratory.

The bottom line is that if you are any of the cutting edge techology/development/futuristic research or in support function, the place to be is India.

Big Vee you are exactly right India is hot and will be hot through this century into the next. I do hope President Kalaams vision of India will happen before he passes away. But the BSE at 11,300 I have no second thoughts about it happening in the next 15 to 20 years.

WE CAN TAKE AN INDIAN OUT OF INDIA, BUT YOU CAN NEVER TAKE INDIA OUT OF AN INDIAN !

Hamara Bharat Mahaan!.

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Speech by Thomas Friedman of The New York Times....

"When we were young kids growing up in America, we were told to eat our
vegetables at dinner and not leave them. Mothers said, 'think of the
starving children in India and finish the dinner.' And now I tell my
children: 'Finish your maths homework. Think of the children in India
who would make you starve, if you don't.'"

WOW ..Lovely post

India is growing even goras says that now ....


I'm proud to be an Indian.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by shankaracharya

BIG VEE you are right on the money in terms of IT!. I know several IT guys in companies like HP in Canada, who had solid permanent jobs for more than 5 years, who were laid off recently have gone to Bangalore, India for undergoing SAP training.

The following areas are in the process of moving to India:

1.IT Departments.

2.Law & IPR-Intellectual Property Departments.

3.Finance & Accounting Departments-there is a wave already happening in US currently, where in they are downsizing these departments and outsourcing it to Indian companies. A friend of mine is currently in USofA with GM and in the process of setting up a outsourcing contract for the accounting-finance department. He is from a big corporate house in India, they will take the contract and then distribute it to smaller companies in India. This will lead to axing thousands of jobs in GM. He tells me that the CPA's are already giving him the cold stare(s).I also know that HP Canada has recently axed several jobs in their accounts department and I do not whatever happened to those jobs?.

4.Call Centers-Customer Service.

5.Automobile Manufacturing and Ancillaries- Just watch what is going to happen after the Delphi-GM issue due in June 2006.

6.Anything related to medical transcription, interpretation of test results involving radiography, CAT, MR Scans.

7.Anything involving Chemical, Pharmaceutical, Material Science and related physical sciences research. If we look at the American Chemical Society's premier magazine-Chemical & Engineering News in the last 3 issues, all the issues are focussing on India's emergence in the fundamental research. They are againg talking about how the outsourcing boom as hit these sectors and companies are moving their corporate R&D setups to Bangalore, Pune and Mumbai. The issue dated March 20, 2006 is titled \\\"INDIA-Scientific powerhouse in the making\\\". They are talking about the rapid way Indian companies, the Government is funding research in India.This issue also talks about availability of equipments in Indian set up which are not available even in top laboratories in US of A.The website is http://www.cen-online.org.Here" rel="nofollow">LINK again they are talking about shortage of trained scientist. The salaries offered are mind boggling starting at Rs.10 to 15 Lakhs for a Indian PhD to anywhere from Rs.25 to 35 Lakhs for an US PhD.The sky is the limit for experienced people in this field. If somebody looks at Jack Welch research centres jobs listing it is so exhaustive to find so many top notch jobs being advertised for there.

Side Note: The counter attack of Desis taking away jobs in the field of Physical Sciences has started the Goras counter attacking in a similar way to the call center or IT jobs. There are many Goras who are willing to move to India to work in a good laboratory.

The bottom line is that if you are any of the cutting edge techology/development/futuristic research or in support function, the place to be is India.

Big Vee you are exactly right India is hot and will be hot through this century into the next. I do hope President Kalaams vision of India will happen before he passes away. But the BSE at 11,300 I have no second thoughts about it happening in the next 15 to 20 years.

WE CAN TAKE AN INDIAN OUT OF INDIA, BUT YOU CAN NEVER TAKE INDIA OUT OF AN INDIAN !

Hamara Bharat Mahaan!.

---

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Truly Indian

I stayed 7 yrs in US and I agree with JRF. US has own problems and moreover till you don’t get US green card your life is really pity in hand of body shopper or when you enter in US everybody see/ask the questions like you are most dangerous person in whole flight. Even we people are doing high paying jobs in US and paying high taxes. When things come to immigration then govt. talks about only illegal immigration people to give them residency (few states has more Mexican than other race) even they are not paying tax and break the US visa/immigration law.
Here in Canada immigration process is not 100% perfect but logical and make sense to me as compare to US.

Moreover how much we would like to run for high paying job/saving $/comparing $/latest technology... most of us are in mid 30's or in early 40's and having family.
Have good time with family and enjoy job/friends/people/city/travel and feel like home.

In one my post I mentioned that I came from a family full of Indian Administrators and class one govt. officers. I know that all these private companies big managers may be IT/telecom/MNC they are like dog in front of IAS/IPS and administrator. If really like to live with respect/money and like God then appear for civil exams and most of us already pass that age I think.
I have seen with my eyes that at my home and dad office how these big companies bosses stand in line and ready to do anything. Our Indian constitution is written like so politicians, celebrities, industrialists and administrators is always like God and others are chicken.

Dear Rahul,

Did you see the post by Chandresh, where in he thought that you, me and TK were one and the same. I wish I were you, I would stayed in India and raked the moolah .

The issue is not jobs for us. We have another 20 to 30 years to go. But what our children would do?.

Would you agree with me, that the high paying jobs will be where High Technology is developed. I know from your postings, that you are in IT. You would agree with me that what was hot yesterday is not hot today. In IT you need to upgrade every minute, to stay on the top of the job market. If the cutting edge development is going to happen in India, your children should be there to reap the monetary benefits for the same. I still remember as one of the first student of NIIT in India back in mid-80's I used to learn MS-DOS on a 286/386 machine. Where can I use that knowledge today?.

Today whole departments are closed and moved over to locations which we cannot even locate on the map. That is due to the technology \\\"You\\\" are developing(I'm not from IT), but what will happen if the same thing happens to us ?. Who knows whether we will have our current jobs in the next year or not?. This is again due to IT.

I'm very convinced that IT will rule and will throw all other sectors into disarray of off-shoring/out-sourcing in every part of the world. We will be also required to face the music shortly. If a giant like US of A cannot oppose this wave, what do you think Canada do?.

Prevention is better than cure!(prevention I mean preparedness !).

Did you read the latest exodus from the Maharasthra government , where in the Babus are leaving the government and joining Reliance.

Do not give up on India. Whatever you may say India ruled the globe many centuries ago, and it is time for India/us Indians do so again. Yes it would take time, but have you seen the strides the IT sector has done in India irrespective the problems in infrastructure. What will happen if the infrastructure is fixed for the manufacturing sector.

Yes Babus are ruling now, but due you see the difference between 1990 and 2006. Have you visited India recently and seen the cell phone service or the banking or the latest cars there?.

India has been an independant country for the past 59 years while USA is more than 200 years.

Be patient, the IT technology you are developing today will put India on the fast track and make you redudant also.

The knife that cuts the butter will cut the throat also!.

Hamara Bharat Mahaan - Right !

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Speech by Thomas Friedman of The New York Times....

"When we were young kids growing up in America, we were told to eat our
vegetables at dinner and not leave them. Mothers said, 'think of the
starving children in India and finish the dinner.' And now I tell my
children: 'Finish your maths homework. Think of the children in India
who would make you starve, if you don't.'"