What about our children?
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Posted on: 30-03-05 13:22:01
Quote:
Orginally posted by mercury6
snip
YEs there are differences within christianity. Overall it doesnt play out as difference in relgion would as far as an immigrant goes in a New country. My first impression when I meet a European is He/she is most likey a christian. That they are orthodox or of some other denomination comes later on.
Same with a Muslim. when you hear the name mohammed do you go is that a shiite or Sunni or do you go "that is muslim"?
I think I know what you meant by your last statement. I personally dont think like that , but yes some might. I also dont find that as a reason for not integrating.
Don’t mean to get into a huge debate about religion now!
Fact is in most of North America, no one gives a damn about your religion! I’m a practising Catholic and its not like I invoke my religion in my day to day interactions with people so I absolutely don’t understand how being ‘Christian’ provides immigrants with ‘religious affinity’.
This ‘cultural superiority complex’ ends up parents not being able to adjust (because they perceive all of the west as ‘decadent’) and they try to pass that on to their kids who don’t necessarily agree (basically ties in to what Chandresh pointed out in his post).
Jake
I’m digressing from the topic here, but thought I should correct what is a frequent misconception amongst desis. Amongst ‘white-born Canadians’ the Portuguese and Italian immigrants are pretty regular church attendees. You may have meant 'Anglo-Saxon' instead of 'white-born'
Quote:
Orginally posted by mercury6
But again its not that simple. the east europens (or any european) who came here generations could move directly to smaller towns and countryside and be a farmer. Can we?)
Again digressing, but solely to answer this point.
You're comparing apples and oranges here. The 'East Europeans' who came here 'generations ago' were either from the labor class / farmers themselves or came here fleeing famine or repression and had no other option but to get into a primary occupation.
Its more likely that what prevents you from going out to farm in Saskatchewan is the fact that you have never done that before. If someone was to offer you an attractive software job in Saskatoon, on the other hand, I'm sure you wouldn't decline it because of 'cultural / religious' reasons, would you?
Quote:
Orginally posted by mercury6
I dont mean all this in bad sense and dont want this to be a discussion on racism.
A East European has more cultural similarities with the native Canadian white popoulation (of which many are themselves of East European origin) than we do. do you think this is true or not?
Merc, I've read your many posts and I know what you are trying to say. I know you do not mean any of this in a negative sense.
Yes when it comes to race the east europeans DO fit into the stereotypes that people seem to have of 'canadians'. However, at the end...its still a stereotype. Just the skin color does not make one feel 'canadian'. Nor does religion...as my last post tried to explain. Go to a catholic parish for a church service...and I promise you you will not feel out of place due to your visible minority status.
Many of the eastern europeans feel as much an outsider as many desis. I have explained some of this with the example of our polish friends. They still speak with an accent, have strong ties to their own cultures...and consider North-American culture alien. They are also as protective of their kids( have kids the same age as mine...our daughters go to the same school) as we are. They speak in Polish at home...my kids speak better english than theirs if that really matters.
The links I sent shows what I'm trying to convey. As you read...the accent was a major hinderance to making many kids, be it russian/polish, feel canadian.
Like what Chandresh mentioned earlier(example of parents being confused)...the answer may well lie within rather than outside.
What does it actually take to call oneself a canadian?...maybe the question. For some it may mean race, for some an accent, for some religion, for some language, for some place of birth.
For some... like me...it may just mean the knowledge that I belong here as much as anyone else. If someone else does not agree, its their problem...not mine
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Quote:
Orginally posted by crenshaw
Jake
I’m digressing from the topic here, but thought I should correct what is a frequent misconception amongst desis. Amongst ‘white-born Canadians’ the Portuguese and Italian immigrants are pretty regular church attendees. You may have meant 'Anglo-Saxon' instead of 'white-born'
I think the newer the immigrants the more likely they are going tobe religious...be it from western, eastern europe OR asia. Down the generations all seem to have a problem sustaining the same intensity of religious practice.
Anyway the italians and portugese numbers are not that huge in our parish so they still make a minority. What about yours...what do you think the ethnic mix is in your parish? I'm just curious to know if only the catholic churches I go to are dominated by visible minorities.
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Quote:
Orginally posted by crenshaw
Again digressing, but solely to answer this point.
You're comparing apples and oranges here. The 'East Europeans' who came here 'generations ago' were either from the labor class / farmers themselves or came here fleeing famine or repression and had no other option but to get into a primary occupation.
While many desis may not be running from famine, it would be safe to say a lot of people who have come here in the last few decades are not exactly Highly qualified people. Safe it to say that people coming from small villages in Punjab may also actually been farmers. And they are a big lot.
Quote:
Its more likely that what prevents you from going out to farm in Saskatchewan is the fact that you have never done that before. If someone was to offer you an attractive software job in Saskatoon, on the other hand, I'm sure you wouldn't decline it because of 'cultural / religious' reasons, would you?
I have done things here that I didnt do back home.
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I once made a mistake, but I was wrong about it.
Quote:
Orginally posted by jake3d
Anyway the italians and portugese numbers are not that huge in our parish so they still make a minority. What about yours...what do you think the ethnic mix is in your parish? I'm just curious to know if only the catholic churches I go to are dominated by visible minorities.
A little OT,
Are there further groupings in the catholic church? You know like protestants have (lutheran, baptist, etc...)?
WOuld you go into any church, if youdont find a church of your choice near you? would you go into a protestant church?
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I once made a mistake, but I was wrong about it.
Quote:
Orginally posted by mercury6
Are there further groupings in the catholic church? You know like protestants have (lutheran, baptist, etc...)?
yes...there are the syrian catholic, maronite catholic, coptic catholic etc ...most of them in the middle-east. In India afaik...there are the Roman-catholic and the Syro-Malankara Catholic Church. The latter is from kerala and performs their services according to syrian rites(syria was the hometown of st.thomas, of the apostles, who converted a lot of keralites to christianity). However, most syrian catholics in India have been or are part of roman catholic parishes. They do not differ on theology.
Quote:
WOuld you go into any church, if youdont find a church of your choice near you? would you go into a protestant church?
I'm not big on organised religion so you should not be asking me
. Anyways...I would say no. There are quite a few theological differences between the two. I have never been to a protestant church for a service/mass.-----------------------------------------------------------------
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