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  Canada Immigration Forum > General > Sports > Sehawag, Bhajji, Munaf out of tour
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Sehawag, Bhajji, Munaf out of tour




pratickm
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Member since: Feb 04




Posts: 2831
Location: Toronto


I don't agree with this 10 match or out strategy.
Batsmen go through phases and forms.
If this rule were followed, the team would be in constant shuffle and there would be no consistency.
We won't need selectors, managers or even coaches anymore - everything will be automatic.
If a player's average is below a certain arbitrary number, he would be automatically dropped and the next in line will come in - therefore, the team will probably change ever other match or so.

We need a strategy to train, groom and support promising players, while retaining the senior and experienced members of the team like Sachin and Dravid.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Mah deah, there is much more money to be made in the destruction of civilization than in building it up."

-- Rhett Butler in "Gone with the Wind"

 
Post ID: 102432 22-06-07 09:13:04
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puttoo
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Glad to know you think Sachin & Ganguly are an asset to team ....

Quote:
Originally posted by pratickm

Quote:
We keep dropping, re-selecting and re-dropping players.
We are quick to drop newcomers after even 1 bad performance, yet we carry the dead eight of senior players who have stopped performing long ago.
Both Ganguly and Tendulkar fall into this category.



 
Post ID: 102434 22-06-07 09:24:12
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pratickm
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Member since: Feb 04




Posts: 2831
Location: Toronto


Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo
Glad to know you think Sachin & Ganguly are an asset to team ....

I didn't say Sachin and Ganguly.
I said Sachin and Dravid.
Dravid for sure is an asset, IMO.
I'm split about Sachin - I think we need to start grooming a replacement, but it's not time yet to let him go.
Regarding Ganguly, my reasons for not wanting him have more to do with his attitude rather than batting skills.
As I have said earlier, he's territorial, factional and a bad influence on the team.
I don't like this "royal blood, silver-spoon-in-the-mouth" attitude.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Mah deah, there is much more money to be made in the destruction of civilization than in building it up."

-- Rhett Butler in "Gone with the Wind"

 
Post ID: 102442 22-06-07 10:32:10
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puttoo
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So now we have a new criteria for inclusion in Indian team .... your batting skills are not enough ........ "royal blood, silver-spoon-in-the-mouth" i have a different name for it ....... agression ..... take the fight to the opposition ..... as far as attitude is concerened i personally think that this agression is a positive asset...... if he was teritorial ..... you would have team full of players from Bengal .......

Quote:
Originally posted by pratickm

Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo

Regarding Ganguly, my reasons for not wanting him have more to do with his attitude rather than batting skills.
As I have said earlier, he's territorial, factional and a bad influence on the team.
I don't like this "royal blood, silver-spoon-in-the-mouth" attitude.



 
Post ID: 102445 22-06-07 10:49:16
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pratickm
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Member since: Feb 04




Posts: 2831
Location: Toronto


Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo
So now we have a new criteria for inclusion in Indian team .... your batting skills are not enough ........ "royal blood, silver-spoon-in-the-mouth" i have a different name for it ....... agression ..... take the fight to the opposition ..... as far as attitude is concerened i personally think that this agression is a positive asset...... if he was teritorial ..... you would have team full of players from Bengal .......

No, I am not using it as criteria.
It is simply my personal opinion.

If you are so pleased with the current selections, then how come we are not winning games?
Or do you think the performance of the Indian team is satisfactory?
Our record had done to the dogs since the days of Azhar and the early days of Ganguly's captaincy.

I have no problems with any player or any team composition as long as we are winning.
No team can win every game 100% of the time, but we are losing crucial games.
We are losing matches that we either could have won easily or were almost winning (snatching defeat from the jaws of victory).

Our recent test record is also pretty poor.

Would you say that our performance is satisfactory and you are happy with it?
Or is it that you believe our performance is not good, but there's nothing we can do about it - just sit around till some genius batsman or bowler materialized out of thin air and improves our team?

-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Mah deah, there is much more money to be made in the destruction of civilization than in building it up."

-- Rhett Butler in "Gone with the Wind"

 
Post ID: 102446 22-06-07 11:06:03
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puttoo
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Pratick ... i am aware of the dismal record of Indian team ... but is the solution removing players who are performing (but not to full potential) and replacing them with newer & younger players ..... keep on trying them .... let me give you an exmaple .... we had Suresh Raina in the team .... he played about 36 one dayers ....... should he replace Sachin .... look at their performance..... for comparison I am taking Sachins last 35 innings in One dayers for comparion .... knowing that he is not performing well
Suresh Raina - 36 ( M) - 612 (R) -0 (100) - 3 (50) - 26.20 ...... the last time he made a good score ... that is over 50 was about 17 matches back
Now for sachin - 35(M) - 1112 (Runs) - 3( 100) - 7 (50) - - 38.34 ... on top of that he has 10 wickets also ..... now that means every 3.5 game he makes 50 / 100 .........
This is what pisses me of .... people dont know how India is going to win matches .... so the solution is replace older players with younger players .... if you look at first class matches some of these young "proteges" have played ... they still cant match Sachin or even sourav's performance .... even when they are not performing to their full calibre ...... but they still can give any younger player run for the money.


 
Post ID: 102450 22-06-07 11:18:22
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pratickm
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Member since: Feb 04




Posts: 2831
Location: Toronto


I agree with what you say, however, it is not fair to expect someone like Raina to compare against Sachin or Ganguly yet.
The latter are much more accomplished and experienced.
But if we keep going down this path what will we do 5 years from now?
Eventually, the likes of Sachin, Ganguly, Kumble will have to retire.
At that point if we don't have any real replacements, we'll be in a very bad situation.

See what happened to West Indies team after Walsh and Ambrose left bowling.
Or after the likes or Haynes and Viv Richards retired from batting.

What happened to England after Gooch, Gatting, etc. retired.

Sri Lanka is also headed that way after Jayasuria leaves.
But they at least have Vaas and Murli to make up with bowling.

We have to start training and grooming other players.
If we don't drop some of the current players who are not helping us win games anyway, then how will we ever grow new players.

Agarkar is not winning any matches for us.
I'm not sure about Ganguly - I'll have to look up the stats on recent matches, but my guess is that he's not being a ball of fire.

Our team appears strong on paper, but we are not winning games.
That's my complaint.

Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo
Pratick ... i am aware of the dismal record of Indian team ... but is the solution removing players who are performing (but not to full potential) and replacing them with newer & younger players ..... keep on trying them .... let me give you an exmaple .... we had Suresh Raina in the team .... he played about 36 one dayers ....... should he replace Sachin .... look at their performance..... for comparison I am taking Sachins last 35 innings in One dayers for comparion .... knowing that he is not performing well
Suresh Raina - 36 ( M) - 612 (R) -0 (100) - 3 (50) - 26.20 ...... the last time he made a good score ... that is over 50 was about 17 matches back
Now for sachin - 35(M) - 1112 (Runs) - 3( 100) - 7 (50) - - 38.34 ... on top of that he has 10 wickets also ..... now that means every 3.5 game he makes 50 / 100 .........
This is what pisses me of .... people dont know how India is going to win matches .... so the solution is replace older players with younger players .... if you look at first class matches some of these young "proteges" have played ... they still cant match Sachin or even sourav's performance .... even when they are not performing to their full calibre ...... but they still can give any younger player run for the money.


-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Mah deah, there is much more money to be made in the destruction of civilization than in building it up."

-- Rhett Butler in "Gone with the Wind"

 
Post ID: 102452 22-06-07 11:26:57
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puttoo
Senior Desi
Member since: Jan 05




Posts: 1096
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Quote:
Originally posted by pratickm


Our record had done to the dogs since the days of Azhar and the early days of Ganguly's captaincy.





Ganguly played 20 series as Capt. ....... the first ten series he won 5 . lost 3 and drew 2 series ...... the last ten series he played he won 5, lost 2 and drew 3 .... & the losses were to Australia & New Zealand in New Zealand. .... the last 4 series he played as captin he won 3 and drew with Pakistan .... so it was not only early days .... his record as captain has been consitent.


 
Last edited by: puttoo on 22-06-07 11:32:17
Post ID: 102453 22-06-07 11:27:21
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pratickm
Global Moderator
Member since: Feb 04




Posts: 2831
Location: Toronto


Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo
Ganguly played 20 series as Capt. ....... the first ten series he won 5 . lost 3 and drew 2 series ...... the last ten series he played he won 5, lost 2 and drew 3 .... & the losses were to Australia & New Zealand in New Zealand. .... the last 4 series he played as captin he won 3 and drew with Pakistan .... so it was not only early days .... he has record has been consitent.

I'm missing something - so why isn't Ganguly the captain?

-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Mah deah, there is much more money to be made in the destruction of civilization than in building it up."

-- Rhett Butler in "Gone with the Wind"

 
Post ID: 102454 22-06-07 11:32:08
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puttoo
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Member since: Jan 05




Posts: 1096
Location:


We are a nation of winers ..... so if we missed beating a depleted Pakistan someone has to pay ...... then in Zimbabwe ... he had a spat with Greg Chappel ..... that time in India the new team with Sharad Pawar had taken over BCCI .... so he had to go ...... it was mentioned his batting was not upto the mark ......he had scored a "slow hundred "against Zimbabawe in Bulawayo ..... so much for picking players on performance .....


Quote:
Originally posted by pratickm

Quote:
Originally posted by puttoo
Ganguly played 20 series as Capt. ....... the first ten series he won 5 . lost 3 and drew 2 series ...... the last ten series he played he won 5, lost 2 and drew 3 .... & the losses were to Australia & New Zealand in New Zealand. .... the last 4 series he played as captin he won 3 and drew with Pakistan .... so it was not only early days .... he has record has been consitent.

I'm missing something - so why isn't Ganguly the captain?



 
Post ID: 102459 22-06-07 11:41:26
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